We have seen a lot of new items in recent years from slot lock flights and punches to the Cosmo Fit Flight system and everything in between that, then there has been new coatings for darts and recently new materials used such as carbon Fibre, even dartboards have seen some innovation!

What does everyone think of this, have manufacturers run out of real ideas and thinly disguising what they release as been innovative?

Have we become too gullible and get easily taken in by what is little more than gimmicks?

I like some of the recent ideas such as the fit flights but can't really say they have enhanced my skill only made it easier for me to pop the flights back on.

With the recent release of the Unicorn HD dartboard and Unicorn using current buzzwords such as HD and 3D in their recent products, are we been taken for a ride as consumers?

I like the Fit Flight system and that has definitely helped my game.

Other gimmicks though I'm not too sure about:

- the Intelite system from One80 is a good system to replace the flight protectors and rings. I may buy some more now they are available in the UK, but I can't see me using them in proper matches as they are a little fiddly to put together, and I also can't see any pro's ever using them

- Condor flights - not yet tried them but I will most likely get a couple of sets when A180 get them in - again can't see any pro's ever using them

- different coatings - no doubt just a way to make us punters pay out more money - Taylor as an example only uses his Rosso's, yet the Phase 5's are also available in a couple of other colours, so no doubt his big fans will have a set of each coating

- Eclipse HD - at the end of the day a board is just a board - the Blades/Eclipse Pro's/Bulls Advantages/Harrows Matchplays of this world are good enough quality for pro and everyday use. I'll most likely get one of the HD boards at some time, but unless they last substantially longer than the aforementioned boards I can't see the need for a new board to be honest

In my opinion, there is only so far that you can go with darts as far as innovation is concerned, and what we are seeing now is manufacturers trying to convince us that their products are innovative. Things like cosmos are great, and I think that they are innovative, but some others are questionable.

The Eclipse HD in my book is just unicorns way of jumping on the HD bandwagon, as I think I posted on another forum recently,I really think some uniboffin thought.....how can we sell more boards...I know let's call our new board HD, then some thinking about what will make the board HD then.....eureka - bigger numbers....what a load of bollocks!

And don't get me started on the Carreras.....too late lol. What we have here is a manufacturer who came up with a new grip pattern and then teased us for over a month with confusing images with a carbon fibre theme, told us to expect revolution not evolution, and then released images of a dart with holes in the barrel for which they want £50 a pop! Have a word Target!!!

Interesting thoughts guys.

Someone has put up some pics of the Unicorn HD board elsewhere and the spider looks very much the same as the Bulls Advantage spider. Its about the only thing on the Bulls I'm not so keen on really and think the Blade 4 probably has the best spider of all the boards.

I guess with a dartboard though there is not a lot of scope for innovation, the spider number ring and sisal is about all that can be changed.

I think more innovation has come from the soft tip side of darts but they seem to charge a premium price for anything new these days which is what make me wonder if we are been sucked in too much?

Its mostly about the money, some things are good but some things are just junk IMO. Cosmos good but way too expensive.

I really do think that the price of the cosmos are a barrier to their success, especially in the UK. They might be helped a bit when more pros start using them, but at the moment, I just don't think too many people outside of forums are aware of them. In the darts league that I have recently started playing in, nobody seems to even know what they are, and when I tell them the price of them, they look at me as if to say, you must be mad mate!

To add to this, i can't see many of the smaller darts shops selling them either, so for the guys that don't buy online and get their stuff from a local shop, or get their flights and stems from behind the bar, they will probably never buy them. I managed to buy some from a shop in Manchester for an absolute steal, basically buy a pack of flights and get a pack of stems free, but that was only because he was clearing them out and wouldn't be getting them back in because they were too expensive, and the owner needed to buy shed loads to make them viable.

Thats the trouble though Danny, they are making these new products but charging high prices too, I never understand why they do that though, its like Sky TV most people dont buy it because it is too much but if they lowered the price then more would buy it and they would still make their profits.

Unfortunately I can't see them lowering the prices for us in the UK as we are about the cheapest market in the World - everywhere else seems to be used to paying stupidly high prices for goods - especially the darts themselves. If they already making profits from markets where the prices are considered normal, then why bother reducing them just for us Brits.

Will they wont take off in the UK market if thats the case, they will only be bought by the likes of us, most will just discard them as been a waste of money.

We are quite the anomaly over here. I would say that other than Japan, we are probably one of, if not the biggest darting nation, so you would think that foreign companies would go out of their way to accommodate our market. At the end of the day if the price is right people will buy, if it's not they won't, but to stick with one pricing strategy worldwide is stupid in my opinion, as grip says, if they lowered it more would buy and they would make more money. At the end of the day British consumers know what they want and we are stubborn in our ways. If car manufacturers can put a steering wheel on the right for us (as a minority nation in this way) then surely others can adapt accordingly for us!

I just started playing again in March of this year. I still watched dart streams every chance I could get. I was NOT aware of Cosmo or Fit products. So to add to what Danny said ^^^^ It's true, I don't think the regular dart player is even aware of these things.

Also... Doesn't it seem like it's just the Americans that soak up all this gimmicky stuff? Look back at the 90's with those god awful movable point darts!! That seems to be all anyone used, and I have to say, I fell victim myself for a SHORT period of time. All the while, I'm watching VCR tapes of pro's and wondering why they don't use them. After all, these guys depend on winning to feed their families and make a living.

All this new stuff I see seems to be geared toward us, the USA customer. Seems as though we'll buy anything. Look at the money the dart companies made off us in the 90's with the darts. they continue to push any gimmick they can think of our way.

My theory is... If the pro's aren't using it, then I don't need it.

There's only so much complexity in the sport. Perfectly balanced/matched/milled dart parts (barrels, points, stems, flights) are about all you can do to the dart itself to help players use whatever talent they have to the fullest. Anything that doesn't do one of those things is probably just a gimmick unless it's a practice aid of some sort.

AWAY from the player however, there's probably a lot of room for real help in learning to make what talent you have work at it's most efficient.

The practice rings advertised here for example. I can't wait to get a set as I've been using bits of paper or coffee filters to create "zones" in which to throw my darts during practice since I know that within the limits of my talent, one of the most important skills I can develop is consistency but "manufacturing" something each time is a pain.

I can also see adjustable "stance markers" of some kind being popular. Maybe little shoe prints or some kind of adjustable brace to place your feet against so you can line up precisely the same way every time to "learn" the right way.

Possible even biometric information to help smooth out the slight inconsistencies in throws (maybe some kind of muscolo-skeletal scan to see how YOUR anatomy deals with the dart throw)...

But I'm American and we love gadgets as was said above.

Chalk Is Cheap wrote:

I can also see adjustable "stance markers" of some kind being popular. Maybe little shoe prints or some kind of adjustable brace to place your feet against so you can line up precisely the same way every time to "learn" the right way.

I was thinking of doing that myself actually lol, I was thinking should I draw round my shoe while I have it in the right spot so I can make sure I stand exactly in the same place each time!

Of course all these recent ideas are just a long line of darts innovations that go back to the 1970's and maybe even earlier, you would be surprised at how many ideas were coming onto the market then, but it seemed to settle down come the 1980's but I think the manufacturers have run out of unique selling points, hence the boom in recent ideas which is admittedly mostly from the soft tip side.

getagrip wrote:

Chalk Is Cheap wrote:

I can also see adjustable "stance markers" of some kind being popular. Maybe little shoe prints or some kind of adjustable brace to place your feet against so you can line up precisely the same way every time to "learn" the right way.

I was thinking of doing that myself actually lol, I was thinking should I draw round my shoe while I have it in the right spot so I can make sure I stand exactly in the same place each time!

Of course all these recent ideas are just a long line of darts innovations that go back to the 1970's and maybe even earlier, you would be surprised at how many ideas were coming onto the market then, but it seemed to settle down come the 1980's but I think the manufacturers have run out of unique selling points, hence the boom in recent ideas which is admittedly mostly from the soft tip side.

I did this with bits of tape on the floor for a while, but it was too hard to move when I felt a need to "tweak" something. Now I just try to find a spot at the oche and do a pre-shot routine sort of thing. "Ok, line up right pinky toe here. Lean forward a bit. Move left foot forward and line up left ankle with right big toe, settle in, now lift the dart, align, settle, adjust etc."

It's "working" in that I'm much more consistent, but I still need a lot of practice.

I wish I had talent. Hearing that James Wade only started practicing darts a couple months ago really hurt my delicate ego. I practice religiously and I'm not even half the dart player he is... /cry.

Wade has been playing all his life from what I know?

But its one of those things that somone may invent as another device like the Sightright to supposedly help improve your game, there I have already named it:

THE FOOTRIGHT!

I love it! Footright, Presented by Getagrip Sports. (tm).



I know those guys have years and years of experience on me. It's just hard to see not throw myself under oncoming traffic when I see any of the top players on the planet (Wade/Anderson for example) admit that they don't really practice when I work so hard at my game and see only tiiiiiiiiiiiiny little improvements month on month.

Fortunately for me, I'm too stupid to quit.

Maybe we are the people the manufacturers are aiming at, we are too gullible and think they may have something to help us improve when all along we should be forgetting everything and just throw the things?

I know I doubt very much I will stop being intrigued by all the new ideas that come out, some of them I do like but cant say any have made me actually play better or if they have it has been so small its not perceptible to me.

Look into the history of any product - automobiles, appliances, firearms, medical devices, etc. There are always more duds than successes. Rarely are there great leaps forward. In general, most of the examples of a product are successful at doing the same thing. How do manufacturers differentiate their widget from the the other guy's widget? With cosmetics and marketing ploys. They always claim to be new and improved, revolutionary, the next great idea. After all, they are in the business of making money by selling things. It's for us to decide if they've met their claim. As long as we believe they do an acceptable amount of the time, we'll keep forgive them when they don't. Consumers have different tastes, so they offer small variations on the same theme hoping to satisfy all those differences. Once in a while, someone actually hits on a change we all like and we call it innovation. I think we all generally agree that embedded spiders on a board are an improvement. Darts made of tungsten alloys are an improvement. Plastic flights are an improvement. Now we're seeing the small variations on these themes. They'll try to convince us we can't live without them. We'll try them, waiting, hoping that they're right about one of them.

Kinda reminds me of the health industry. Supplements to be more specific. You see all these people with perfectly sculptured bodies trying to push a certain supplement with promises of creating a lean, perfect body. LOL

When in reality these people are getting their looks in the form of a needle with some great steroids being injected into their thighs and delts.

I've been playing with a Target Play Vision Hi-Viz dartboard, and I must say that it will be the last time I'll be playing with a dartboard with bright white sectors. My dartboard now looks like it's been battered for years, and it hasn't been with me for a year. If I can find a Blade 4, I would buy that next time.

Other innovations that I'm not too impressed (of course, this is merely an opinion):
1) One80 Solibox - not that innovative.
2) Target Carrera - letdown of the year, for me. I was really hoping for a new tungsten alloy.
3) Unicorn Eclipse HD - the improvements are not really game-changing enough to merit a board change.
4) Coatings in general - The only coating that I have a bit of respect is the Silica. But if the Silica Apollo had a natural tungsten version, I would have bought it instead. A coating, in my opinion, doesn't really affect a dart's effectiveness (unless it's atomised or stone). It's primarily for cosmetic purposes. I have to admit that a brand new gold, black, silica or zirconium coating really makes a dart look good. I would buy a coated dart if it's within my budget. Machina coating is a failure, unless you like your dart to look battle-tested. Latinum is a big failure as well.

Innovations that I'm impressed:
1) Target Sport 90 lineup - Not a fan of grippy darts but if you want a grippy dart, this lineup has a lot to offer. Even if I'm lousy throwing my Sport 90 Extremes, I still keep them because they're really awesome darts. Hope they will grow to like me, hehe. I'm sure someone else in this forum would agree.
2) Punched flights - Ever since I used punched flights, I've had rare flight popouts. So they're working, I guess.
3) Winmau Andy Fordham, the Viking atomised grip dart. As a short-barrel dart user, this has to be one of the most underrated darts that I've thrown. And I'm a Target/Unicorn fan!

Best thing I seen in a while has to be the Fit Flight System....pricey yes....but effective and works great for all that use them! Coatings do not matter.....like mc said....at the end of the day...a board is just a board....but the razor wire boards are the best! When new items come on the market......everyone likes to try new things....sales pitch or trying to keep up the the Jones...or just trying to increase sales ! It will never stop.....soon you will be able to buy a whole dart with the shaft and flight on it....lol...never to break!!!! But all in all Cosmo is Innovative with thier new system....just wish someone in North America or the Uk would come up with a cheaper solution!!!! That is all!!!

Trev fix your avatar lol!

Dartscompanies live from the unsatisfied customer who mostly think that her or his game will be better with a "better" dart whatever that might be: A real good player, watch the YouTube reviews can play well with any dart.
Most topplyers play with rather conservative styled darts.Personaly I like the "special innovative " darts like they are mostly in the US ( Voks) but the sheer beauty of the Winmau Vanquish Gold attract me too, altrough a rather classic design, but with them it is fun to trow as well, certainly not gimmickry, but al their knowledge is in this dart.
Companies have to do every season as if they find out the hot water again, but that is business , otherwise people would play to long with the same darts:-)

McInnis180 wrote:

Best thing I seen in a while has to be the Fit Flight System....pricey yes....but effective and works great for all that use them! Coatings do not matter.....like mc said....at the end of the day...a board is just a board....but the razor wire boards are the best! When new items come on the market......everyone likes to try new things....sales pitch or trying to keep up the the Jones...or just trying to increase sales ! It will never stop.....soon you will be able to buy a whole dart with the shaft and flight on it....lol...never to break!!!! But all in all Cosmo is Innovative with thier new system....just wish someone in North America or the Uk would come up with a cheaper solution!!!! That is all!!!

There is one cheaper or less expensive alternative from One80, look at their website, the product is even patented as it is not entirely the sam as the Japanese competition, Robin Hoods are not possible anymore with them

willy_1957 wrote:

Dartscompanies live from the unsatisfied customer who mostly think that her or his game will be better with a "better" dart whatever that might be: A real good player, watch the YouTube reviews can play well with any dart.
Most topplyers play with rather conservative styled darts.Personaly I like the "special innovative " darts like they are mostly in the US ( Voks) but the sheer beauty of the Winmau Vanquish Gold attract me too, altrough a rather classic design, but with them it is fun to trow as well, certainly not gimmickry, but al their knowledge is in this dart.
Companies have to do every season as if they find out the hot water again, but that is business , otherwise people would play to long with the same darts:-)

its true Willy that its people who think they are going to be better by buying the latest dart, I was guilty of that but I know it does not matter what the dart is it is the player, but I like all the wonderful designs of darts so I find it hard to resist buying more. I had some Vanquish darts and yes they are beautiful darts!

I am trialling fit flights at the moment and I cant really notice any difference over my nylon stem, flight and wizlock cap system. And for the price of the fit flight gear, I dont think I will reinvest in them. I have hacked 2 flights up already along the front edge. The tail end of the flights is still in mint condition.

As for coatings, I feel that the slight shark grip on my puma's and the stickiness of my spit when I lick my fingers out does any magically named coating.

Bump for new members!

Some of the products are great. For one, though more expensive the Japanese barrels! I love my Dynasty A-Flow Burning! Laro and Laro Silent shafts are awesome! Lip Points! You can't beat the durability of both products.

The Asian dart machines have forced some of the other Galaxy etc.. to copy and innovate theirs so this is a good thing.

I recently went back to 100 micron flights as I have the same problems with molded flights that I had in the 90's. They simply split and tear too easily. I am a fan of punched flights and rings.

The other bit of good news is that the innovations have people trying new stuff and talking about it.

This creates excitement and conversation, so that in of it's self is good for our sport.

You have top Asian players playing in PDC events and top Euro and US pros playing in Asian events. Again, this is a win-win.

Not tried those Laro silent spin yet but want to give them ago at some point.

The internet certainly helps with talking about new ideas, I think there was lots of innovation in the early days of darts but no platform for people to talk about it as much as there is now, so I guess feedback to the manufactures was limited.

I like the Laro Silent's. They spin just enough to move out of the way of an incoming dart so you do not get a drastic deflection. I have always like spinning shafts as I can actually tell the difference in my grouping. I like the Laro version as they are based on the Laro shaft.

They seem to be durable but I highy doubt they are as durable as a solid Laro. Have not have on break yet so that is a good thing. They are also simple and light.

I've never been a fan of metal or aluminum shaft ends.